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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 4:20 am 
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Alba & Vespro

Yesterday

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today cam is off :girlsad3:


Annia & Valerio

Valerio

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 2:33 am 
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Passera 04/ 06, 2019 7:28 am


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 3:14 am 
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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 10:52 am 
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I recommend that you observe nest behavior to help us understand when the situation becomes regular.

He left at 11.20 and returned at 12.45
No trace of Grimilde in the nest ... I checked all the time ..

Valerio was in the hatch, then Grimilde arrived and he left (did he expect the change of hatch?),
She remained a few seconds and then away.


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Grimilde (?) NEW Female ?


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 10:54 am 
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Valerio

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 4:40 am 
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Giac 04/ 05, 2019 11:55 pm

The female usurper (we can think of a name to give her ... maybe Grimilde ..) is a real bully.
She is surely the one responsible for the admission of Annia to the CRFS of the LIPU.
The day before Annia if and she was dozing on her four eggs and I imagine the scene: numbed by the labors of incubation she must have asked Valerio to change and left the nest to stretch legs and wings. Probably, so numb, she didn't realize the missile that was falling on her: another female jealous of the beautiful panoramic site where the nest is located and willing to do anything to get it (male included).
Grimilde, the "usurper" is not necessarily stronger or bigger than Annia. He only took her by surprise and this counts more than strength. At LIPU they said that apart from the blood on her head, Annia was perfect with plumage, with a beautiful breast in flesh, and that I too have seen her confirm that she is a beautiful pilgrim! The attack of the female usurper must have caught her by surprise and may have made her slam on a building or made her make a disastrous landing on the ground. But now he has difficulty spreading the right wing and in these conditions he is unable to fly. Therefore it is not possible to put it back in the nest or nearby because Grimilde is still there and would end it very easily.
In all this the male is not that he can do much. First of all, he feels the HUGE responsibility to look after the eggs and he must also deal with HUNGER: every now and then he has to go and get a snack and to do this he has to leave the eggs alone. At the height of the nest on the ACEA tower the wind is much stronger than at ground level and the eggs are rapidly chilled. He knows it and showed in the first day that he was willing to give up eating just to keep the eggs warm ..
Grimilde is much bigger than the male and he is a little afraid of it. He knows that she wouldn't kill him (moreover, what would he do with a nest if he doesn't have a mate) but maybe he still thinks of his ANNIA that knows him and treats him more kindly and so when the usurper shows up he stays very cautious. But his job now is to carry on the reproduction and continue to take care of the eggs, at the cost of accepting the company of a new female.
But while he, who has now gained experience and has the hormones at the right levels, is completely taken up by his reproductive tasks and performs them very well, Grimilde who has missed the preamble phase (courting, pops, flights, prey passages and other fads) and it has not even laid an egg, it probably has lower hormones and instinct alone is not enough to make it understand how a female should behave from a nest.
So while Valerio is consumed trying to keep all four eggs close together in order to keep his skin warm, Grimilde has no clue what to do and scatters them everywhere. It is to be expected however that if the thing goes on, the sight of the eggs, the vocal exchanges with the male awaken in her healthier instincts and maybe, who knows, could start to incubate.
On the other hand, having arrived at this point it is too late to lay new eggs (and then Valerio "has already given") and perhaps it is better to adopt those laid by another.
When we observed this confusion at the nest, complicated by the arrival of bad weather, we worried that the eggs would freeze and any embryos would die. We have therefore decided to keep them safe. We transferred them to an incubator that we were lucky enough to be able to connect to the current in the room below the one where the nest is located. In the nest, however, we left four eggs (empty shells filled with resin) completely identical to those removed, so that the male would not lose his affection for the nest and continue with his activities. At the time of change the eggs were cold and gave no signs of life and this made us worry about the fate of the embryos.
Today we returned to check the incubator and to our surprise two of the eggs had cracks in their shells and the chicks inside emitted strong peeps! This if on the one hand we were very pleased because the "freddata" had no consequences complicates the situation a bit: we were hoping that it would take a little more time to open up and that in the meantime the situation would be clarified among the two females, perhaps Annia could have returned to the reinvigorated nest able to drive away the usurper or the latter could develop maternal instincts.
But now the little ones are about to be born and in this confused situation they cannot be put back to the nest. Grimilde who picks it up with eggs could clumsily kill the chicks and the male would not be able to avoid it. We need a few more days to see how the situation evolves (healing of Annia or Grimilde's banquet) and therefore we will assist us


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 4:42 am 
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Annia & Valerio

04/07 10.33 am

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10.53 am

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10.57 am


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https://youtu.be/Z308QOJBl_g

Valerio incubates artificial eggs. 03/03 Annie was injured at the clinic.
Grimilde appeared, probably the perpetrator of Annie's injury, but she is interested in Valerio's advances.
The eggs are in the incubator and there are already 2 falcons


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 5:35 am 
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Annia & Valerio

11.10 am Valerio returns , He is calling, probably Annie

11.28 am he is flying again


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https://youtu.be/u-s5co_2ciA


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 5:45 am 
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Italy Annie & Valerio

11.35 am Grimilde with visit,makes her holes, she is not interested in eggs


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 7:53 am 
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Alba & Vespro


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Eggs was laids : 3/1 3/4 3/8* 3/10


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm 
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Annia & Valerio

Giac in FORUM

apr 07, 2019 11:44 am

answer to eagle fan:

Annia is now in a box for restricting her movements and help her recovery. She is a wild bird and under stress condition because restricted.
Even if she takes care of the chicks then we should place the chicks in another nest because she cannot raise them until fledging,
Meantime two chicks hatched and are hand reared (there were no other options) to keep them safe. We should see how the other nests are progressing to add them where there will be suitable conditions.

In any case, would be interesting to see how Annia will respond if we provide her with eggs into her confined space. We could make a trial and add some bedding and eggs (fake eggs) to see if she resumes the incubation...

Will try to see this tomorrow..thanks for the suggestion


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:36 pm 
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Annia & Valerio

Beatrice in FORUM

apr 07, 2019 12:20 pm

To me, however, it seems that the male no longer hatches so much ...


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11.36 am

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13.46

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17.18

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 4:19 pm 
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Location: Ameland, the Netherlands
I asked the following on the Italian forum:
Quote:
Is it possible to bring the hatching eggs to the sanctuary where Annia is???
Is she in a well enough condition to care for and feed her chicks? That, in my opinion, would be the best solution in this situation. Worth considering I believe.

This is Giac's answer:
Giac wrote:
answer to eagle fan:

Annia is now in a box for restricting her movements and help her recovery. She is a wild bird and under stress condition because restricted.
Even if she takes care of the chicks then we should place the chicks in another nest because she cannot raise them until fledging,
Meantime two chicks hatched and are hand reared (there were no other options) to keep them safe. We should see how the other nests are progressing to add them where there will be suitable conditions.

In any case, would be interesting to see how Annia will respond if we provide her with eggs into her confined space. We could make a trial and add some bedding and eggs (fake eggs) to see if she resumes the incubation...

Will try to see this tomorrow..thanks for the suggestion

giac

So, at least eggs have hatched :hatchegg: :hatchegg:

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:06 am 
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Alba & Vespro

:hatchegg:


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 9:22 am 
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Alba & Vespro

14.09 First feeding for FIRST CHICK


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:31 am 
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:hatchegg: :hatchegg: :hatchegg:

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Message from maria luisa Mon Apr 08, 2019 3:38 pm

Did I understand that 3 were born and the fourth is still not and is in an incubator?


Message from Beatrice Mon Apr 08, 2019 4:05 pm

Yes: wink:

Message from maria luisa Mon Apr 08, 2019 4:12 pm

But if Annia will be ok you will try to put the 3 pulletti and the egg back into their nest to see if she will do what she should where she was interrupted - in spite of herself - hoping that everything will be fine and that the male will return and Grimilde will not .


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:33 am 
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and PIP in next egg

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:18 am 
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Alba & Vespro

:hatchegg: :hatchegg: :hatchegg:

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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:32 am 
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Annie & Valerio

From FORUM After translating

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Message from Maria Luisa 04/09 5.50 am

It's CLEAR MESSAGES. This means that if Annia can not fly anymore, she will be destined for the rest of her life in the cage. Poor! Are 3 chicks also in LIP?


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 Post subject: Re: ITALY ~ Miscellaneous 2019
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:52 am 
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Alba and Vespro

04/10 11.57 am Lunch for Three chicks with Dad,

Dad feeding , Mom arrived with food , he departure , She feeding

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later dinner with Mom

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https://youtu.be/Xui7nDQy0Uw



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